NEX-6 discussion

[Vivek]

A few initial impressions from the past few hours..

The EVF is nice but when compared to the EVF of NEX-7, there is a clear difference. The 7's EVF much better.

The kitzoom 16-50 PZ is only tiny while not in use. Convenient to transport. That is all the positive I have about that zoom.

The 18-55 is better.

The camera (NEX-6) balances well, the controls are visible and are really useful. It does come with a hotshoe flash cover. Every fit (hotshoe cover) controls (on off switch included), LCD tilt, etc are a bit tight and work only with a bit of resistance.

The video button can be switched off although it is located out of the way.
I am yet to assign custom functions but all the useful stuff I need are already there without any customization.

I have to check out the Apps section and see if I can buy anything that would be useful.

Overall a very useful camera.

[flint-hill]

Would you mind saying a little more about the 16-50? What didn't you like about it? In what ways did you find it inferior to the 18-55? Are there specific defects or aberrations that you noticed? At specific focal length ranges, maybe?

I'm very curious about this lens, and I respect your judgment on such things, so I'd love to learn more of what you think of it.

[simonclivehughes]

Vivek, it seemed to me looking at the pictures you posted in the other thread you started that the images were not very sharp, especially on the edges of some. Looked like the AF wasn't hitting the intended area. Were you zone focusing?

Cheers,

[redsim74]

Originally Posted by flint-hill

Would you mind saying a little more about the 16-50? What didn't you like about it? In what ways did you find it inferior to the 18-55? Are there specific defects or aberrations that you noticed? At specific focal length ranges, maybe?

+1 to some further discussion around this.

[Vivek]

Originally Posted by flint-hill

Would you mind saying a little more about the 16-50? What didn't you like about it? In what ways did you find it inferior to the 18-55? Are there specific defects or aberrations that you noticed? At specific focal length ranges, maybe?

I'm very curious about this lens, and I respect your judgment on such things, so I'd love to learn more of what you think of it.

At the widest, it reminds me of the 16mm f/2.8.

Simon has a point, I think. The shots I show were done under very cloudy conditions (total cloud cover) and the AF might have misfired (I had the phase contrast points on).

I checked the CV 15/4.5 I have yesterday (indoors) and I still like that a lot. The 16-50 is not for me. I rarely use zooms. I have the 18-55 because it came with the 2nd NEX-7 bought.

The zoom does not have a hood. Has 40.5mm filters.

[Vivek]

I also suspect that the NEX-6 has an AA filter like NEX-5 and 7 and unlike the C3, 5N and F3.

This will be confirmed when I open up one in the near future.

A tid-bit:

The camera weighs 288g and the camera manual weighs 260g.

[DamonJoyce]

Originally Posted by Vivek

I checked the CV 15/4.5 I have yesterday (indoors) and I still like that a lot. The 16-50 is not for me. I rarely use zooms. I have the 18-55 because it came with the 2nd NEX-7 bought.

You feel that it has the same AA filter as the 5 and 7, but not the 5N and C3. Do you get purple colorcast on the 6 with the CV15 like you do with the 7, or is it clean like the 5N? This is the $1,000 question!

Also, on the 7, I have the MF assist set to the AEL button (easy to find in the EVF when using alt lenses). Can you set MF to any useful button other than A or B (like Fn, or AEL)?

[Vivek]

Absolutely no color fringing and such problems with the C-V 15/4.5 (and several other manual focus lenses) on the NEX-6.

I have not looked at the AEL button customization but I would think it can be set to manual assist (magnification).

Also, under the PASM wheel there is one more wheel. Very useful and is very accessible while shooting.

I will be buying at least another body very soon. The camera is superb.

[santiclaws]

The EVF is not as nice as the one on the 7? In what way? I thought they were supposed to be identical?

[Vivek]

They are certainly NOT and Sony lied (there is an youtube piece where the Sony guy claims they are the same).

Looking at the 6's EVF is like looking at a fine pitched TFT monitor. Not very annoying but it is there.

[Vivek]

There is no difference between this (NEX-6) and the 5N with respect to C-V 15/4.5. That is what I meant. I will check photographing my monitor for color shifts.

[santiclaws]

Originally Posted by Vivek

They are certainly NOT and Sony lied (there is an youtube piece where the Sony guy claims they are the same).

Looking at the 6's EVF is like looking at a fine pitched TFT monitor. Not very annoying but it is there.

I wonder if there is something wrong with yours. Every single preview from a professional publication I've read has said that the EVF is exactly the same as on the 7, which I assume is what Sony told them. I can't fathom Sony lying to everyone, that would be disastrous for them.

[Vivek]

Originally Posted by santiclaws

I wonder if there is something wrong with yours. Every single preview from a professional publication I've read has said that the EVF is exactly the same as on the 7, which I assume is what Sony told them. I can't fathom Sony lying to everyone, that would be disastrous for them.

Quite possible. The 6's EVF is not as good as the 7 (2 samples from very different batches).

[santiclaws]

Originally Posted by Vivek

Quite possible. The 6's EVF is not as good as the 7 (2 samples from very different batches).

I wonder if the different sensors could have something to do with it.

[Vivek]

Originally Posted by santiclaws

I wonder if the different sensors could have something to do with it.

Don't know.

I will wait for the experts to chime in when they get their NEX-6'.

[Taylor Sherman]

Originally Posted by Vivek

Absolutely no color fringing and such problems with the C-V 15/4.5 (and several other manual focus lenses) on the NEX-6.

Dear Vivek,

Please allow me to present my polite argument that this statement could give one the wrong impression. As evidence, I do in fact see color fringing in your photograph with the combination, as seen in this thread:

http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/sony/4...tml#post462062

I should not normally be this presumptuous, but I think perhaps you meant to say that the color fringing is no worse than on the Nex-5N. I have a funny feeling that is the case, please forgive me if I am wrong.

yours sincerely,
Taylor

[bcm]

I'd agree with Taylor. The shots with the 15 do look like they have colour cast on the edges. Nowhere near as bad as the ZM 25 on my NEX 7 though.

[Vivek]

It is no worse compared to the NEX-C3 or NEX-5N. I believe that is what the original query was about (post #7). Certain posts got eliminated as they were going off topic and towards personal attacks. I thank the site administration for their kind and immediate action.

Here is a link to a full sized image. OOC jpg. NEX-6, C-V 15/4.5, f/5.6, ISO100.

All sizes | Untitled | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

[JimBuchanan]

As a NEX-7 user with the latest firmware and LR with the Flat Field plug-in, I'm still interested in the image quality of the NEX-6 and rangefinder wides such as the C-V 15/4.5.

The link to a full sized image looks pretty good, but is a NEX-6 OOC jpg doctored in any way? it would be nice to have access to a RAW file, somehow.

On a separate note, I was able to get decent corners with the CV 15/4.5 on my NEX-7, if I focused and exposed for the extreme corners, then run Cornerfix. I see smeared corners in the lower left and right, and sharp far distance objects in the upper right. Maybe this image would benefit from corner focus improvement? Just a thought.

[Vivek]

I will be getting my upgrade to LR3 next week. When I said OOC jpg, that is what it is. What the camera does to RAW files and jpgs, I have no clue.

[Vivek]

Customization is limited to only two buttons- the AEL and soft key B.

After having battled with the menu for an hour, I think there are problems with the firmware version 1.0.

soft key B appears to have a mind of its own and the function button appears non responsive to changes.

A set back but I am confident that SOny will update this sometime soon.

The wheel under the PASM wheel has very limited use and its look do not reflect its usefulness at all.

[Vivek]

There is one positive with FW updates.

The 18-55 and the 24/1.8 after updates to FW Version 2 (simple and fast) allow the use of phase detection (AF) in NEX-6.

Now, the 50/1.8 OSS, Sigma DN 30/2.8 and the 30/3.5 Macro are without these updates and do not activate phase detection.

I would particularly like an update for the Sigma DN 30/2.8.

PDAF, as Sony claimed, appears to offer faster auto focus indeed.

[thrice]

The EVF is the same as the A99.
Improved response speed and also behaviour with high-gained subjects in low light.
I've shot extensively with the A99 and NEX-6.
Unfortunately my experiences with the EVF do not mirror Vivek's, I found it vastly superior to the slower/blockier EVF in the NEX-7/A77.

[Vivek]

That is good to hear, Daniel, as I will be getting one more soon for UV/IR work and will have a chance to check.

Do you find any problems with the customization and the control wheels or you just had the cam on loan for testing?

[Justinl]

Just thought I'd make an account at last. I have had a Nex 7 which I sold 6 months ago and now have a Nex 6 . My friend still has his 7 so I have been able to compare the VF. My findings are the same as Daniel's I find the 6 VF to be more detailed and a faster refresh rate than the 7's.

I haven't used the 6 enough yet but I prefer it ergonomically to the 7, the control dial with the ring underneath is far better than the Tri-Nav. I also for some reason think it feels better in the hand. I have also had no cases of overheating for the video after a couple of tests. I'll get out this week properly with the camera and hopefully give a more in-depth report.

[jsnack]

I read on dpreview that Sony does not provide a battery charger with the kit...is that true?

[bcm]

Originally Posted by Vivek

PDAF, as Sony claimed, appears to offer faster auto focus indeed.

How is it at tracking moving objects such as children (not sure if you have any to practice on!)?

[Vivek]

Ben, I used Leica R, Nikon F and Olympus pen F for tracking (all manual focus). Now, it is quite different as the child is photo conscious. So, it is a straight no or on very rare occasion, a proper pose.

The big question with the NEX-6 is why an even number?

You will get there pretty soon. Enjoy every minute!

[Justinl]

Originally Posted by jsnack

I read on dpreview that Sony does not provide a battery charger with the kit...is that true?

Correct you charge directly through the camera now via micro usb. advantage is you can now charge the camera as long as you have access to a computer and usb or micro usb plug.

[simonclivehughes]

Originally Posted by Justinl

Correct you charge directly through the camera now via micro usb. advantage is you can now charge the camera as long as you have access to a computer and usb or micro usb plug.

In which case you probably had access to an AC socket... not sure I follow your logic here.

I'd much rather have a standalone charger that I can have a battery charging in while I'm out shooting. This is just the manufacturer chipping away at what they provide to the customer while raising their margin.

Cheers,

[Justinl]

Originally Posted by simonclivehughes

In which case you probably had access to an AC socket... not sure I follow your logic here.

I'd much rather have a standalone charger that I can have a battery charging in while I'm out shooting. This is just the manufacturer chipping away at what they provide to the customer while raising their margin.

Cheers,

How about a car, or a computer or a battery pack it gives tons more choices as it is using a standard micro usb connector for the charging cable! I am sure you will be able to buy a charging pack as an added accessory if you really need one.
I find this a far more elegant solution than having a separate charger and ac plug and then having to find a plug socket, it's just like charging a mobile phone now, for me it's progress rather than a margin issue, they are trying to standardise everything which for us as a consumer is far better. You are out and about, misplace your charger unit, how easy is it to get a new one, whereas to replace a micro usb cable.....

[Vivek]

The USB charging affair has its plusses and negatives. Emergency charging is fine and easy.

The camera's battery will drain any laptop's battery very quickly.

I like the stand alone charger myself (and I have quite a few now).

[simonclivehughes]

While I agree that USB charging can offer some advantages, I see no reason not to include a charger with a camera when it is sold. Other than, of course, to save the manufacturer money, and force the consumer to pay more for a standalone unit.

Cheers,

[Vivek]

I am not sure how much money is saved by this USB charging business, Simon.

The NEX-6 comes with a mains to USB (5V, 500mA) converter.

Maybe in the future they will make that also as an option?

[simonclivehughes]

Understood, Vivek, I just think that if one has more than a single battery that this is an incomplete solution.

Cheers,

[Taylor Sherman]

Regarding the EVF - a good point was raised on the FM Alt forums. The EVF itself may be better, but the image could still be worse (or at least different enough for some to prefer the Nex-7). It depends on the sensor and the real-time processing done to create the RGB image shown.

[Vivek]

I don't know if the stupid WiFi can be turned off for good. Its location right below the EVF possibly causes problems. I have seen banding (red colored lines, fortunately they do not get recorded) depending on the location that never occurs with the NEX-7.

[bipbip]

Hello. I've just bought this camera after using a Panasonic G1 for 3 years. I was hoping for better 800 and 1600ISO than the G1. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong but at these ISOs I get lots of noise in RAW and jpegs are so mushy they look like watercolors - at 100%.

[bcm]

Originally Posted by Vivek

Ben, I used Leica R, Nikon F and Olympus pen F for tracking (all manual focus). Now, it is quite different as the child is photo conscious. So, it is a straight no or on very rare occasion, a proper pose.

The big question with the NEX-6 is why an even number?

You will get there pretty soon. Enjoy every minute!

Sadly no.1 is at the stage of "no" already. No.2 is too young to understand what is happening so I'm making the most of that while I can.

I only use manual glass as well but was just curious if you'd tried AF on the 6.

[pophoto]

Vivek or other Nex6 owners:

I am interested to know how the shutter sounds on the Nex6. I own the original 5 and 5n, and one thing that has always bothered me is the shutter sound is quite audible and a sharp mechanical sound and not well dampened! Is this still the case with the Nex6?

Thank you in advance!
Po

[Vivek]

Hi Po, The sound in my NEX5N is a faint tinny sound (shutter assembly has had a slight mod). Compared to that, the shutter in 6 Is quite audible and plasticky.
I will try to muffle it soon with some special materials i have.

Off the shelf shutter sounds of both 5N and 6 are more audible (to me) relative to that of the 7.

[pophoto]

Thanks Vivek, so it seems the 7 is the most dampened. I wonder when they will address this. I really feel all mirrorless should be silent! (Personal preference of course!)

[mazor]

Originally Posted by Vivek

Hi Po, The sound in my NEX5N is a faint tinny sound (shutter assembly has had a slight mod). Compared to that, the shutter in 6 Is quite audible and plasticky.
I will try to muffle it soon with some special materials i have.

Off the shelf shutter sounds of both 5N and 6 are more audible (to me) relative to that of the 7.

oooh, a modified shutter? Please do tell what the mod has been doen to your 5n shutter?

[hot]

Sony NEX-6 teardown and Infrared conversion - YouTube - infrared

[Vivek]

Looks like there is no blur filter (aka AA filter) and only an IR/UV cut filter in the 6.

Originally Posted by hot

Sony NEX-6 teardown and Infrared conversion - YouTube - infrared

[mazor]

thats good for IQ for still, gues they are keeping in line with the Nex 5 16mp series cameras.

What could be an issue is moire in videos though with the absence of AA

[Vivek]

Originally Posted by mazor

thats good for IQ for still, gues they are keeping in line with the Nex 5 16mp series cameras.

What could be an issue is moire in videos though with the absence of AA

How does this make you feel?- Sony NEX-6 test on Vimeo

[zombii]

Regarding the EVF, I don't see any noticeable difference between the 6 and the 5N other than the 6 being internal. If anything, the view seems more open and less sensitive to eye position. Having had a 7, I don't think it was superior to the 6 in that regard.

As for the battery charging solution, this is a serious cheap out by Sony. So following their way of thinking, you can't use the camera while you're charging your battery? Hello? Did it dawn on them that some people might actually be doing some serious shooting where they'd have more than one battery so they could charge one while still shooting? So just add $20 to the price and give us a charger with the camera.

And then they make it worse by switching to a micro-USB connector. What brain trust thought that was a good idea? Probably the people that thought they could sell more cables by doing it. This and the battery charging solution are good examples where Sony outsmarts themselves. They come up with a good product then cripple it with some design aspect that either makes them look cheap or which is incompatible with the rest of the world. As a company, I do not like them even if the NEX cameras are good overall.

As for the Wi-Fi, I want to be able to turn it off. At the very least, it has to be a battery drain and if the RF in any way impacts the images, it needs to go away. I say this because the noise pattern in the NEX-6 images appears to be of a fine grain similar to the 5N but it appears to be denser. There is also some very slight banding that I don't see in the 5N. Exactly how much this affects real images is yet to be determined. It's entirely possible this is a difference between the individual imagers in question but I was hoping to see noise at least as good as the 5N if not better and so far, it's not better at the very least. I'm very interested to see formal reviews of this.

[Nettar]

zombii, in relation to your last paragraph, DxO's comparison of the 5N with the 5R indicates that the latter has gained a little in dynamic range, but at the expense of high ISO performance, relative to the former: DxOMark - Compare cameras side by side . One is tempted to conjecture that the 6 will be closer to the 5R than to the 5N, but the 6 hasn't been tested by DxO yet.

I actually prefer the versatility of the add-on EVF on the 5N, but I'm in a small minority here. Nettar

[zombii]

Thanks Nettar, I hadn't seen that. I swear Sony seems to be determined to sabotage the very thing that makes this camera attractive (to me). Unfortunately, the external EVF is one of the negatives about the 5N for me. The thing is a constant pain getting it in and out of the camera bag and I don't like that it won't lock in the down position. However, looks like I'm not going to be selling it right away after all. I did some side by side shooting with both tonight. The difference is small but there's a difference. Question is can I live with it.