A macro lens for the view camera

[cunim]

Here's one for all you lens lovers.

I am looking for something that does macro (uop to about 1.5:1) with movements. .There seem to be only three options that are actually available with shutters. These are the Rodie 120 apo sironar digital macro, and the Schneider 120 macro apo digitar in asph and non asph version. I have the apo sironar. I am told the digitar 120 non asph is pretty similar to that, and that the asph is not really optimized for 1:1 so it would probably be less good. However, I am not sure how they define good. It's not really about sharpness on center. It's about how well the IC holds up as you move.

I can push the 138 HR to about 0.5:1 before it really degrades but that lens is not for real macro. The apo sironar does macro just fine, but it's IC degrades as you start to stress it. Is there some special sauce with the Schneider IC that improves performance in outer parts of the IC?

I seem to remember the 120 apo sironar being pretty good with the IQ180. With the IQ4, I am less pleased with its moved performance. Strange that finding a movable macro is so hard. The SK 120 BR is a great stacking lens, as is the 105 Rodie (don't have any direct experience with this one), but neither are movable. So I keep using the Rodenstock. I would get one of the Schneiders if I thought they would do any better but I have not found any solid advice about that.

Anyone?

 

[Alkibiades]

there is only one schneider Apo digitar macro 120 mm and it is simply the relabled macro symmar hm 120 mm.
The 120 mm aspherical is not a macro lens, it is optimated on infinity. it is the apo digitar n with aspherical glass, it shares the classic Apo Symmar 6 elements lens design.
becouse of the aspherical glass it is also not bad in close distance- like apo sironar s becouse of the ED glass- but it is not a classic macro lens.

 

[Alkibiades]

the 3 classic macro lenses are:
- rodenstock Apo sironar digital macro 5,6-120 mm, ( relabled Apo Sironar macro)
- schneider Apo Digitar Macro 5,6-120 mm ( relabled Macro Symmar HM )
- schneider Apo Digitar Macro 5,6-80 mm ( relabled Macro Symmar HM )

 

[dchew]

I think @jng uses the HB-Z 120 on his Cambo / IQ4150. But I don’t know how much of the image circle he uses.
Dave

 

[Will Deleon]

I interchange the 120mm Rodenstock Macro and the 120mm BR macro depending on the shoot needs. I haven’t had any issues with the Rodenstock. I shoot with it commercially and it’s delivers. It does starts to degrade with more extreme movements, but it keeps up really well with 2:1 magnification with the use of extension tubes on my Rollei studio tech cam. I would love to see a new design from Rodenstock though, especially something that can be slapped on an X Shutter. One can only dream

 

[buildbot]

Isn't the Nikon 120 AM-ED supposed to be quite good? https://robert-otoole-4zae.squarespace.com/nikkor-am-ed-120-test

 

[cunim]

I interchange the 120mm Rodenstock Macro and the 120mm BR macro depending on the shoot needs.

Will, that is exactly what I do. Typically, I stack with the 120 BR and use the Rodenstock when I move or need higher mags. I just find the Rodie is not giving me clean images in the IC periphery - or at least not as clean as I remember them from the fat-pixcel IQ180. The lens is going to Greiner for optimizing (thanks for the link) and I'll post again once I get it back.

Trouble is we see reports of one lens or another being sharp on center and holding up well in the periphery. Those flat field peripheries are not easily extrapolated to studio use . My 120 Rodie is fine on center and is also pretty good in the corners - as a scenery lens. It has more problems doing nonparallel movements at close range and, after all, that is what it was designed for.

 

[Alkibiades]

When you are interested in getting for sure 100% of that what these macro lenses can achieve you should take a look on latest schneider apo digital version of the both macros that are mounted in schneider aperture mounts, very exactly calibrated by schneider and fixed with glue. These lenses cant be open any more, no shutter change will be possible but you will get the best perfomace for ever. You will need a back with ES for it.

 

[doccdiamond]

Interesting enough I used the Rodie HR-Dig W 90mm for macro work (watches) with some extension tubes - VERY sharp. I was really surprised. Can't comment on field curveture or anything like repro work, but for objects just in the center it was unbelievable great. Discussed it at ALPA and they were surprised as well!

 

[anwarp]

I have used a 135 mm Schneider enlarger lens with movements. I‘m away from home so I don’t have the details of the lens.

 

[jng]

I think @jng uses the HB-Z 120 on his Cambo / IQ4150. But I don’t know how much of the image circle he uses.
Dave

The Hasselblad-Zeiss 120 Makro-Planar and S-Planar require extension tubes to get to 1:1. Without, I think they get down to maybe 1:5 (perhaps more - I’m not near my gear right now to check). I typically don’t use movements when shooting macro so can’t speak to usable image circle, but note that these lenses were all designed for 6x6 format and typically have some room for movements.

John

 

[rdeloe]

Have you been to Robert O'Toole's Closeup Photography site? I feel like I've suggested it before, but I don't trust my memory. Robert passed away recently -- a big loss for the photography community -- but his site hasn't degraded yet. https://www.closeuphotography.com/

Robert was very impressed with the S-K Makro-Symmar 120mm f/5.6 in the Makro-Iris mount. https://www.closeuphotography.com/schneider-makro-symmar-sr-120 I had one of these and it is superb. They are often glued down to the best azimuth by Schneider before being sold. The Makro-Iris system is really nice because there are so many bits and pieces you can use to assemble different configurations. The adapters you would need to get from V-Mount to anything else are available from Schneider (rare and hard to find) or eBay sellers in China (cheap and easy to find). Custom ones can also be fabricated.

 

[daz7]

I have used a makro symmar HM 180mm lens (in an aperture mount but you can get them in shutters too) a couple of times and it is outstanding for true macro if you need movements.
Quality wise it is on par with Rodenstock's 120mm macro but gives you over 200mm of image circle and you can shoot from far enough to place the lights anywhere you want.

Hopefully your Rodie will get fixed - mine is doing extraordinary well across it's whole image circle, regardless of how much movements I apply.

 

[FloatingLens]

I can also confirm that the Makro Symmar HM 5,6/120 is very good on digital with a massive image circle. Using it with the CFV II 50c. Off-center image quality degrades, but my guess is a BSI back might not be affected by smearing and color shifts as much.

 

[cunim]

Interesting enough I used the Rodie HR-Dig W 90mm for macro work (watches) with some extension tubes - VERY sharp. I was really surprised. Can't comment on field curveture or anything like repro work, but for objects just in the center it was unbelievable great. Discussed it at ALPA and they were surprised as well!

Could you provide a link to a high-res sample of this? I'd love to have an excuse to get that lens. Extended spacing doesn't work too well with the 138 float. Once I push it much beyond it's specified 0.7:1 I start seeing chromatic aberration and other issues - and softer images of course. Best I can do with high quality is about 0.6:1 but that is pretty useful.

The 90 is specified at the same 0.7:1 so, if you can push it much beyond that, I expect it is a function of the design difference (probably the float in the 138).

 

[Duff photographer]

Have you been to Robert O'Toole's Closeup Photography site? I feel like I've suggested it before, but I don't trust my memory. Robert passed away recently -- a big loss for the photography community -- but his site hasn't degraded yet. https://www.closeuphotography.com/

Bu**er!

I used his site a lot when I was sorting out my micro photography set-up, so I owe him thanks. I hope his site stays up somehow, so that the work he did doesn't fade away.


Thanks,
Duff.

 

[rdeloe]

Bu**er!

I used his site a lot when I was sorting out my micro photography set-up, so I owe him thanks. I hope his site stays up somehow, so that the work he did doesn't fade away.


Thanks,
Duff.

I hope so, but I just don't see how that would work. At some point his domain registration and web hosting bill is going to come due. When it's not paid, the site will go down.

He was such a nice guy. I learned a lot from his site and from him. So friendly and helpful.