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Thoughts on Leica SL2 with M-lenses (landscapes)
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Paul Spinnler
Well-known member
APO SL
APO is the highest quality stuff Leica makes. Extreme correction of wavelengths for ultimate sharpness.
The APO SL glass is beyond anything else in 35mm.
No brainer if you own a body already.
APO is the highest quality stuff Leica makes. Extreme correction of wavelengths for ultimate sharpness.
The APO SL glass is beyond anything else in 35mm.
No brainer if you own a body already.
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I got into the SL system with the idea to use M lenses often, but ever since getting a few APO L mount primes and even some much less expensive Panasonic L mount lenses like the 28-200 and 14-28, I find using M glass other than difficult to focus M lenses like the 0.95/50 and 1.4/75, are no longer used. AF is so easy for me.
Paul Spinnler
Well-known member
Well the allure of the M glass if you own the SL glass in my view is reduced to the Noctiluxes 50/75, Summiluxes and the two APO lenses 35/50.
1) You can use them on an M body, let's say to differentiate on an M11M; the M is still more compact say for an outing in a social context and I really like its go-everywhere non-intrusive nature;
2) The M lenses above render differently than APO SL; APO SL is quasi perfect, almost clinical while Summiluxes and Noctiluxes especially capture light in a very special way
3) M APO make the SL camera very compact
So I see a reason for both, but the more standard M glass I wouldn't get anymore.
The magic is in the fast M stuff.
The SL, with APO glass, is a more significant body / lens combo to carry around and the M with a small APO50 is still unique, especially if your primary reason to go out is not to shoot all the time.
1) You can use them on an M body, let's say to differentiate on an M11M; the M is still more compact say for an outing in a social context and I really like its go-everywhere non-intrusive nature;
2) The M lenses above render differently than APO SL; APO SL is quasi perfect, almost clinical while Summiluxes and Noctiluxes especially capture light in a very special way
3) M APO make the SL camera very compact
So I see a reason for both, but the more standard M glass I wouldn't get anymore.
The magic is in the fast M stuff.
The SL, with APO glass, is a more significant body / lens combo to carry around and the M with a small APO50 is still unique, especially if your primary reason to go out is not to shoot all the time.
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MGrayson
Subscriber and Workshop Member
Just my I’ll-informed PoV, but I find the old pre-APO Summicrons to be a lovely blend of modern acuity and older “look”. Neither extreme is as appealing to me. Others might find in them an annoying lack of either quality. It’s personal. But the 28, 35, 50, and 75 Crons were my favorite M lenses. They’re closer to the more modern S lenses in rendering, although not the same.
Matt
Matt
PeterA
Well-known member
1. The 21SEM and 24Elmar ( now out of production) are outstanding performres on the SL2 for wide shooting using M glass - the tri-Elmar not so much.
2. You wont get 'better' colour in Leica V GFX - you get 'different' - good thing about the SL2 colour is that it doesn't have the M11 pink eye rubbish going on - but GFX files are much more maleable in post if that is something you do. The SL2 is best for fat ligt situations as are most cameras anyway.
3. I use 28 | 35 from Voigtlander because they are tiny and small for both M moncrome shooting and occassionaly on SL2 because they are small and punch abopve their weights and cost in terms of IQ. However be prapredfor these lenses to dim over time - just a fact of cheapie life) ( as an aside there is negligable difference between the Voigtalnder 50 Apo lanthar and the Leica 50 apo (I know becaue Ive owned both.) The 0.95 Nocti and 50 Summilux are Much better on an SL2 V any M body as is the 75 APO and 90 APO M lens.
4. You won tbe unhappy with Sigma offerings - but you will be happier with native SL lenses - the 24-90 and 90-280 zooms are exceptional - the only thing I dont like about the 24-90 is the lens extends out and that is a personal quirk of mine I don't like this in any lens- the 90-28- is very heavy.
5. I shoot with 35|50|70 and 90 APO primes on the SL2 - if you want the best high contrat lenses ever made with incredible resolving power - yoiu can't go past these ( or their cost) - in real world use you get the same results out of offerings from Sigma | Panasonic at 30% of the cost - but if you want the best 'modern' lenses these are it
6. Nothing Leica makes can match the IQ of Fuji or Hasselbald MF - but neither of these camera systems play particulrly well with M lenses and dont at all with L mount (of course) but then again why bother with leica when you can shoot with hasselblad lenses anyway or the better examples of Fuji.
Happy shooting and dont forget the difference between most focal lengths can be accounted for by how much you can move your feet I shoot pretty much with 21-24mm and 90mm focal lengths these days in 35mm and MF.
Paul Spinnler
Well-known member
Well excited for the 2025 gen MF APO optics in the S4. Apparently they've taken everything they've learned from the SL APO line (tolerances, manufacturing efficiency) + S (line their CS tech) and combine it for a new cutting-edge set of optics. They also are developing I thin generation five of aspheric technology, something the competitors from Asia cannot do. The proof will be in the MTF charts of the new stuff.
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Jon Warwick
Member
I don’t know the other focal lengths as well, but I’m often drawn to using my 50mm Summicron v5, despite having APO lenses too. Its rendering, as you say, is a lovely blend of modern acuity and something more “classic”. On the M11 Monochrom especially, I find the 50 v5 to be wonderful - the Monochrom sensor has such high acuity anyhow that a less obviously “sharp” lens can be a fine pairing.
And for head portraits on the M11 or M11M, I’d pick the v5 every time over an APO.
The main issue that I find it has is a lot of field curvature - to get properly sharp edges, I’m needing to stop all the way down to f11 for landscapes, whereas a modern APO lens is flat field and with sharp edges from the get-go.
I similarly enjoy the last of the M 90mm Elmarits, albeit the 50 v5 provides a more precise capture of fine details.
Paul Spinnler
Well-known member
And with Summiluxes overall, there's just a way they capture light which makes them truly unique ... a glow with acuity
Thank you for these thorough insights! Much appreciated. The lens recommendations are well noted. In terms of color, I get a pleasing output (for me) which is easier to work with (again, for me) than with my GFX system. I know that this doesn't have to be the case, as there are plenty of pictures with pretty colors from the GFX system in this forum, but I struggled. Most likely more a lack of skill from my side.
Coincidentally, I shot the SL2 side-by-side with my 907x CFV100c last weekend in the Alps. The files from the 907x are much more malleable, BUT .. the combination I shot (907x with P645 75mm, 15mm of shift applied vs SL2 in high res mode with Planar 50/2) turned out to be sharper on the SL2. Well, it's 187mp vs 100mp, but I was still surprised by the result. Now while the Planar 50/2 is good, I can imagine that the large SL primes are a lot better. So the overall image quality from this system is really high, particularly in multishot.
I worked with a few Sigma primes on my Canon EF system while ago. They were solid, but I always preferred in the end the Canon primes, so I'll skip Sigma in L mount. Currently I adapt Canon EF lenses with pleasing results.
Jon Warwick
Member
...and by extension, I recently road-tested an SL3 + SL 50 APO versus my GFX100S + GF55mm. With carefully resampled images to up to 60" wide, I can see no perceptible difference at all in fine detail that was recorded by the 2 systems when studying the part of the frame that's perfectly in focus. I was shooting distant landscapes / cityscapes, RRS 3-series tripod, f5.6, base ISO, and looking at the files really closely. If anything, more of the frame of the SL3 was typically in perfect and consistent focus too. Incredible really, and not intuitive considering the 60mp vs 100bps difference. I can't explain my observation, but possibly the remarkable performance of SL APO lenses offsets the 40mp sensor difference when it comes to actual detail recorded?
I can only imagine what the SL3 would be like in multi-shot mode! ...in that regard, I'm surprised it has not been launched (yet?) in a firmware update. Who knows, I hope the delay is simply because they're astutely working to make multi-shot really good on the SL3.
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Paul Spinnler
Well-known member
Its the APO SL glass. When I look at some images at 200% in C1, it looks like 100% on other systems; they are the best possible optics quality, perfectly corrected at F2 across the frame. It is totally remarkable.
The same will go for the new S4 glass which is also specc'd to be APO. This means with Leica you'll have an optical resolution boost too ...
The same will go for the new S4 glass which is also specc'd to be APO. This means with Leica you'll have an optical resolution boost too ...
PeterA
Well-known member
You are welcome - the SL2 is a great 35mm camera and lens mount for anything anyone woudld like to try enjoy ! In my experience - the GFX had a slight magenta issue to always deal with - the X2D has none.
I have a few tripods sitting in my garage somewhere -Ive never used the pixel shifting capabilities of the SL2 - and will never use the same now available in the X2D.....if I was interested in landscape shooting I might still use a tripod too - but I dont do any of the stuff that requires 'futzing' - anymore. Whatever I can carry in a small back pack when I ride my motorbike or in hand when I walk is all I want to carry. I gave away a couple of MF backs and my Alpa gear to persons who thought they could get use out of them. I'm currently thinking about getting a polaroid printer so I can get instant gratification from pics on my phone and the most important subjects to me these days are my family shots.
Yes everyone has their own individual photographic journey and experience is the best teacher. There is no such thing as a bad camera or lens in my opnion. Congratulations on your purchase and dont forget to post pics!
atb
Pete
On the long end, my purchase was successful: the Tele-Tessar 85/4 works very well. Now coming to the wide angle, my Biogon 35/2.8 is not so sharp for landscape shots in the corners. It's okay, but nobody carries such a system to get "okay" results. I tried briefly the Apo-Lanthar 35/2 and found its rendering a bit cool. Sharpness was good.
Since I'm a big fan of the Zeiss glass, I wondered if anyone has experience of the Distagon 35/1.4 ZM on the SL2 for landscapes? How are the corners at f8?
At this price point, a whole lot of alternatives come into the picture, but I would like to keep my lenses in M-mount to be able to also use it on the M6 (and maybe the digital M body in future, who knows..)
Thank you!
Since I'm a big fan of the Zeiss glass, I wondered if anyone has experience of the Distagon 35/1.4 ZM on the SL2 for landscapes? How are the corners at f8?
At this price point, a whole lot of alternatives come into the picture, but I would like to keep my lenses in M-mount to be able to also use it on the M6 (and maybe the digital M body in future, who knows..)
Thank you!